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Hi everyone,
Its been a long time since I've been on here... and I'm back to needing advise.. Sterling is still not house trained. He will be 2 in November. I have tried crating him, litter training him, letting him stay in a small mud room during the day without anything to mess on.. but NOTHING has worked. In the crate, we made it smaller (we were told a he would be less likely to mess in a smaller space...) not true for sterling, he messed in his crate and laid in it... both # 1 & 2. When we tried to litter train him, he would go on the floor and never once go in the tray we had. If i have a bed or a blanket in there he will go on that and then lay in it... if I dont have a bed or anything in there he will still go on the floor. Ive tried toys, kongs, marrow bones... you name it.
We have a normal daily routine. He has to sleep in the hall because there is tile in there and we dont want him to mess on the carpets. So I get up, get ready for work (he is still sleeping) we go down stairs, I immediately take him outside and con him to go #1 & #2 then I make a big deal out of it because he went outside!!! yey!!! and go in and give him a small piece of a cookie. He then has his food, sometimes he is hungrier the other day. (One morning he might not eat all his food, others he woofs it down). I then get my lunch packed and put him in the small hall with his bed, a toy and sometimes a blanket for him to cover up if its cold. I understand that an 8 -9 hour work day is a LONG time for a little dog to hold it... but he does this even if I go shopping for food or even out to dinner... thats normally only 3 hours at the most... and I would have had him go to the bathroom before we have left.
When we go outside its like torture to get him to go. He will sit there and shake and then lay on the ground if my boyfriend brings him out (he has never scolded him or punished him I'm always the bad guy) and we cant figure it out... I can have him go outside and he will look at me so I say hurry up go pee or hurry up go poop and he will run off and start to find a place... so I'm thinking "GREAT!" well 25 minutes later of him doing a circle literally... and he still hasnt gone... So I still say Sterling hurry up go pee or poop and he then circles and circles and circles again... If a bird sqwacks, if a person talks, if a plane flys by, if a car drives by... it TOTALLY makes him loose focus and we are then... again... back at square one of finding a place to go and circles and circles and circles....
I feel soo bad because he knows when he goes in the house its not right, he gets very bashful and timid.. so I know he knows its wrong... but I just dont know WHY he is doing this... I have been patient, I know this breed is very hard to house train.. and I have gotten my boyfriend to be patient... but I am afraid after another morning like to day (he woke up for work, went into the hall and stepped in poop...) I am going to get the old "its me or the dog" speech and of coarse its going to be the dog for me.. because I cant picture my life without my little guy... and I just really want to get this problem solved... Because we both love sterling to death if we could just fix this one issue he would be everything we are looking for in a dog and then some...
So if anyone has had this problem, has any ideas that I could try or just has any to say lol PLEASE let me know!
oh, and I'm not sure if this matters lol but Sterling still pees like a little girl, so I dont think its "marking" hes territory....
PLEASE HELP!!!
Ashley
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Messing In The House
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#2
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Posted 19 July 2010 - 06:06 AM
Ahhh i know your pain all too well.
My IG Baxter is only 10 months old, hes pretty much fully house trained now (except for the occasional accident)
I spent countless hours with him (i only have a part time job, so this made it so much easier. Not sure if this would have worked if i was working full time) He would do the same as your IG. Id take him outside after meals and hed stand around for ages not doing anything, thinking i was punishing him!! Then id be like 'Well, ok you can come in, but if you poop you'll be in big trouble'......5 mins later, poop on the carpet!!
I read countless books and internet sites on house training, i dont use the crate training, just the general 'go outside' method.
So heres a few tricks i used when training Baxter:
-I adjusted his diet, fed him quality eukanuba dried food and cooked chicken. I'd read that cheaper 'supermarket' foods actually makes them poo a lot more often (and found out that this was very true indeed)
-After every meal, it became routine to go outside where we'd play with a ball or something to get the bowels moving. Usually worked after a few minutes.
-Major praises and kisses once he had 'gone' outside.
-When inside, i'd always make sure he was in view and so i could see if he was circling around and looking suss. I could also catch him in the act, which is the best way to make them realise they are naughty!
-Straight after (or sometimes during) his accident, id take him straight outside onto the grass.
-I also made sure i cleaned up these accidents very thoroughly, as they tend to want to 'go' near the places that smell like faeces.
-I also found a product in a pet shop that was a spray. It claimed to help the pup recognise areas as toilet areas, as you'd spray it on the grass outside or wherever it was ok to go.....To be honest i never tried it! But the concept is interesting.
I keep him outside (with the laundry door open so he can get cover and sleep in his bed) during the day when i'm out. So thats never really been a drama. He's quite good now, he will let me know if he needs to go to the toilet by wimpering and sitting in the hall, or scratching at the door. He usually needs to get up once through the night (but so do i, so its not that bad!) Occasionally he will make a mistake, usually when i go for sleep overs at my parents place. Unfamiliar house and area, it throws him out of his routine a bit! (Bit worried as i'm moving house soon, dont want to go through this all again)
Having said that, he hasnt had an accident for nearly 2 months.
Hopefully you can find something that works for you soon,
Good luck!!
My IG Baxter is only 10 months old, hes pretty much fully house trained now (except for the occasional accident)
I spent countless hours with him (i only have a part time job, so this made it so much easier. Not sure if this would have worked if i was working full time) He would do the same as your IG. Id take him outside after meals and hed stand around for ages not doing anything, thinking i was punishing him!! Then id be like 'Well, ok you can come in, but if you poop you'll be in big trouble'......5 mins later, poop on the carpet!!
I read countless books and internet sites on house training, i dont use the crate training, just the general 'go outside' method.
So heres a few tricks i used when training Baxter:
-I adjusted his diet, fed him quality eukanuba dried food and cooked chicken. I'd read that cheaper 'supermarket' foods actually makes them poo a lot more often (and found out that this was very true indeed)
-After every meal, it became routine to go outside where we'd play with a ball or something to get the bowels moving. Usually worked after a few minutes.
-Major praises and kisses once he had 'gone' outside.
-When inside, i'd always make sure he was in view and so i could see if he was circling around and looking suss. I could also catch him in the act, which is the best way to make them realise they are naughty!
-Straight after (or sometimes during) his accident, id take him straight outside onto the grass.
-I also made sure i cleaned up these accidents very thoroughly, as they tend to want to 'go' near the places that smell like faeces.
-I also found a product in a pet shop that was a spray. It claimed to help the pup recognise areas as toilet areas, as you'd spray it on the grass outside or wherever it was ok to go.....To be honest i never tried it! But the concept is interesting.
I keep him outside (with the laundry door open so he can get cover and sleep in his bed) during the day when i'm out. So thats never really been a drama. He's quite good now, he will let me know if he needs to go to the toilet by wimpering and sitting in the hall, or scratching at the door. He usually needs to get up once through the night (but so do i, so its not that bad!) Occasionally he will make a mistake, usually when i go for sleep overs at my parents place. Unfamiliar house and area, it throws him out of his routine a bit! (Bit worried as i'm moving house soon, dont want to go through this all again)
Having said that, he hasnt had an accident for nearly 2 months.
Hopefully you can find something that works for you soon,
Good luck!!
#3
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Posted 27 July 2010 - 06:29 PM
One thing that's been reiterated in literature and on this board is that it takes consistency, PRAISE, and A LOT of patience. Further complicating matters is your eight-nine hour absence.
To me, it sounds as if Sterling needs to be walked right after he's fed... walked in the morning and walked in the evening. A long, brisk walk will help him sleep during the day and at night. He might be getting bored and restless being alone for so long. Consider, too, that the more active he is, the faster the food will digest, and perhaps the greater chance of setting up consistent relieving intervals. Walking will also give him a chance to sniff around, thus kicking in his instinct to mark his territory and then finish his "business" outside. If he relieves himself indoors, it may not be a bad idea to take his solids and put them outside where he can pick up the scent the next time he's let out. Always, always make a big deal when he does his business outside. You can even establish one certain treat that he is given after he comes in from going potty. If you do that, be sure not to give him this same special treat at any other time and only when he’s actually gone potty outdoors.
If you haven't tried it yet, I'd have him sleep with you at night. As an only IG, your absence may be making matters worse because he misses you and requires more companionship. With him in bed, you'll know if he stirs, and if he doesn’t immediately settle back down, you can take him outside. This works best if you maintain a regular sleep schedule. You can also try putting a diaper on him during the day, removing it only when you take him outside. Ideally, he should be brought out often until a routine is established.
I'd also reintroduce the crate a little at a time until it becomes a comfort zone for him. He'll be less likely to relieve himself in this case. However, the amount of time he's left by himself will certainly make this task incredibly challenging.
I agree with Yachtson about the food. You need to get him on quality food, if he isn't already. That will help tremendously with digestion and the amount of times he needs to relieve himself of solids.
Be aware that nothing is full-proof. This breed operates on their own time and on their own terms. They also don’t always let you know when they have to go potty, which is why you need to watch for signs and adhere to a schedule. Sterling will continue to make mistakes from time to time and he’ll be reluctant to relieve himself in inclement weather. What's important is that although you may want to scold him, you have to refrain from doing so. This breed really does respond best to praise, and if you’re visibly and audibly upset, Sterling will pick up on it, making him more nervous and further hindering your efforts to train him.
Finally, stick with one routine, try to make it fun, and try to maintain it.
I hope this helps. Good luck.
To me, it sounds as if Sterling needs to be walked right after he's fed... walked in the morning and walked in the evening. A long, brisk walk will help him sleep during the day and at night. He might be getting bored and restless being alone for so long. Consider, too, that the more active he is, the faster the food will digest, and perhaps the greater chance of setting up consistent relieving intervals. Walking will also give him a chance to sniff around, thus kicking in his instinct to mark his territory and then finish his "business" outside. If he relieves himself indoors, it may not be a bad idea to take his solids and put them outside where he can pick up the scent the next time he's let out. Always, always make a big deal when he does his business outside. You can even establish one certain treat that he is given after he comes in from going potty. If you do that, be sure not to give him this same special treat at any other time and only when he’s actually gone potty outdoors.
If you haven't tried it yet, I'd have him sleep with you at night. As an only IG, your absence may be making matters worse because he misses you and requires more companionship. With him in bed, you'll know if he stirs, and if he doesn’t immediately settle back down, you can take him outside. This works best if you maintain a regular sleep schedule. You can also try putting a diaper on him during the day, removing it only when you take him outside. Ideally, he should be brought out often until a routine is established.
I'd also reintroduce the crate a little at a time until it becomes a comfort zone for him. He'll be less likely to relieve himself in this case. However, the amount of time he's left by himself will certainly make this task incredibly challenging.
I agree with Yachtson about the food. You need to get him on quality food, if he isn't already. That will help tremendously with digestion and the amount of times he needs to relieve himself of solids.
Be aware that nothing is full-proof. This breed operates on their own time and on their own terms. They also don’t always let you know when they have to go potty, which is why you need to watch for signs and adhere to a schedule. Sterling will continue to make mistakes from time to time and he’ll be reluctant to relieve himself in inclement weather. What's important is that although you may want to scold him, you have to refrain from doing so. This breed really does respond best to praise, and if you’re visibly and audibly upset, Sterling will pick up on it, making him more nervous and further hindering your efforts to train him.
Finally, stick with one routine, try to make it fun, and try to maintain it.
I hope this helps. Good luck.
This post has been edited by IGDaddy: 27 July 2010 - 06:32 PM
#4
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 08:04 PM
Hi Ashley...
I think there are several things going on in your situation. One of the main problems, as you pointed out, is your work schedule consisting of an 8-9 hour leave. This is much much too long of a period of time to expect him to "hold" himself. If you cannot come home during lunch or on break to let Sterling out to eliminate, you need to have someone (a dog-walker) come to your house, to do so, part way through the day.
I feel strongly that Sterling is confused and doesn't know what you want of him. If he is sleeping in his feces and urine, this has become a habit that he is not aware is incorrect.
It sounds as if Sterling has never been housebroken. If that is the case, you will need to revert to the very beginning and retrain him as if it were day one. I realize you do work many hours but the only way to effectively house train him is to work with him one on one consistently. This would mean watching him, some even revert to having him leashed to you, until you can learn the signs he shows when he needs to eliminate.
It is extremely important to use one method and stick to it. The more you change your methods, the more confused a dog will become. You state you have tried crating him, making the crate smaller, litter training him, letting him stay in a small mud room, using outdoors... That is much too much!
In my opinion, if your work schedule demands this much time away, the best concept for you and for Sterling is a topped ex-pen. Within this ex-pen you should include a litter box lined with newspaper, his bed, his water dish and toys. This way he can eliminate when you are away. This does not mean he will train himself to use the litter box. You will need to show him what to do. Again, you will need to start from the beginning... taking him to the box, high praise, etc. The less mistakes he makes the more it becomes habit to eliminate in the correct place.
A good way to reinforce the box training is by starting with a clean sheet of newspaper lining the box. When he urinates in the box, overlay the soiled newspaper with another sheet, don't remove the soiled one. Continue to do this throughout the day. If he makes a mistake and urinates on the floor, soak up the urine with the newspaper and place that sheet in the box. When he has a bowel movement, leave enough on the newspaper to scent the area and flush the remainder. At the end of the day, clean the box and reline with a clean sheet of newspaper. When a mistake is made, bring him into the litter box, otherwise ignore it. When he uses the box correctly, praise him. All previously soiled areas in the home should be cleaned thoroughly with a product to eliminate odors, such as Nature's Miracle.
There was mention in another post to put "a diaper on him during the day, removing it only when you take him outside". Respectfully, this should never be used as a form of house training and should never be used as a way of preventing a dog from eliminating. There are a number of medical reasons why this should not be done. First let me say there is something called "dog pants" and "belly bands". Neither of these is used to house train. Dog pants are used by breeders when a female is in estrus (heat cycle) to avoid soiling furniture or carpeting with blood. Belly bands are, also used by breeders, for a male during the time a female is in estrus. This prevents "marking". Marking is not the same as the need to urinate.
The medical reasons not to use a diaper include:
-urinary tract infections due to stagnant urine
-gastrointestinal disorders/infections
-exploratory surgery if diaper is ingested
Vigorous exercise morning and night are wonderful ways to bond with him. This will help him both mentally and physically. It will also tire him during the hours you are away. IGs bond with their people and find it very difficult to be away from them for long periods of time. It is the makeup of the breed that cannot be trained out of them...
Try retraining him like it was the first day you brought him home. Use the method above with the ex-pen and litter box. Don't move the litter box once it is in place. Any change will confuse him. Take him back to the box every two hours or sooner if he hasn't eliminated. Happy happy praise... Consistent, positive reinforcement...
I think there are several things going on in your situation. One of the main problems, as you pointed out, is your work schedule consisting of an 8-9 hour leave. This is much much too long of a period of time to expect him to "hold" himself. If you cannot come home during lunch or on break to let Sterling out to eliminate, you need to have someone (a dog-walker) come to your house, to do so, part way through the day.
I feel strongly that Sterling is confused and doesn't know what you want of him. If he is sleeping in his feces and urine, this has become a habit that he is not aware is incorrect.
It sounds as if Sterling has never been housebroken. If that is the case, you will need to revert to the very beginning and retrain him as if it were day one. I realize you do work many hours but the only way to effectively house train him is to work with him one on one consistently. This would mean watching him, some even revert to having him leashed to you, until you can learn the signs he shows when he needs to eliminate.
It is extremely important to use one method and stick to it. The more you change your methods, the more confused a dog will become. You state you have tried crating him, making the crate smaller, litter training him, letting him stay in a small mud room, using outdoors... That is much too much!
In my opinion, if your work schedule demands this much time away, the best concept for you and for Sterling is a topped ex-pen. Within this ex-pen you should include a litter box lined with newspaper, his bed, his water dish and toys. This way he can eliminate when you are away. This does not mean he will train himself to use the litter box. You will need to show him what to do. Again, you will need to start from the beginning... taking him to the box, high praise, etc. The less mistakes he makes the more it becomes habit to eliminate in the correct place.
A good way to reinforce the box training is by starting with a clean sheet of newspaper lining the box. When he urinates in the box, overlay the soiled newspaper with another sheet, don't remove the soiled one. Continue to do this throughout the day. If he makes a mistake and urinates on the floor, soak up the urine with the newspaper and place that sheet in the box. When he has a bowel movement, leave enough on the newspaper to scent the area and flush the remainder. At the end of the day, clean the box and reline with a clean sheet of newspaper. When a mistake is made, bring him into the litter box, otherwise ignore it. When he uses the box correctly, praise him. All previously soiled areas in the home should be cleaned thoroughly with a product to eliminate odors, such as Nature's Miracle.
There was mention in another post to put "a diaper on him during the day, removing it only when you take him outside". Respectfully, this should never be used as a form of house training and should never be used as a way of preventing a dog from eliminating. There are a number of medical reasons why this should not be done. First let me say there is something called "dog pants" and "belly bands". Neither of these is used to house train. Dog pants are used by breeders when a female is in estrus (heat cycle) to avoid soiling furniture or carpeting with blood. Belly bands are, also used by breeders, for a male during the time a female is in estrus. This prevents "marking". Marking is not the same as the need to urinate.
The medical reasons not to use a diaper include:
-urinary tract infections due to stagnant urine
-gastrointestinal disorders/infections
-exploratory surgery if diaper is ingested
Vigorous exercise morning and night are wonderful ways to bond with him. This will help him both mentally and physically. It will also tire him during the hours you are away. IGs bond with their people and find it very difficult to be away from them for long periods of time. It is the makeup of the breed that cannot be trained out of them...
Try retraining him like it was the first day you brought him home. Use the method above with the ex-pen and litter box. Don't move the litter box once it is in place. Any change will confuse him. Take him back to the box every two hours or sooner if he hasn't eliminated. Happy happy praise... Consistent, positive reinforcement...
This post has been edited by sheri: 28 July 2010 - 08:44 PM
Daune Sheri
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